Hey, welcome back to Barrel to Bottle, The Binny's Podcast. I'm Pat. I'm an insufferable know-it-all at Binny's. I've got a couple of people here in the room with me today. I'm Alicia. I have to share an office with the insufferable Pat. Here to talk about wine and Thanksgiving pairings and I don't really like turkey. That's the thing about Thanksgiving, nobody really likes the turkey. Everybody knows that it's the sides that are the best. I'm Roger, big fan of stuffing and beer aficionado, seltzer, cider. Smooch. We've got Chris Dillon in here today too. What's up, Chris? I'm Chris. I do wine. I am an insufferable know nothing. Every year I ask Pat this, how many other days of the year do you have turkey if you love it so much? I love it so much that I managed to convince my wife to host two Thanksgiving dinners this year. We have my family coming over the Saturday before and her family coming over on Thanksgiving itself. I've already ordered two turkeys. If you needed another reason to feel bad for Pat's wife, here's one. I have a good turkey and it's cooked to perfection. We use the Alton Brown recipe and it's a wet brine overnight, and then it just really gets about a pound of Irish butter between the meat and the skin, and then it turns out excellent. Shocking. That's always the crutch. When in doubt, slather it up, prevents the dried out bird. All right. Real reason we're here though, we're talking about Thanksgiving and what to drink with it. Yeah, we do need to survive all of our families that day. That's why we're so busy during the holidays. You're in Lausanne town and there's no way to get yourself through it unless you get a little tipsy, I think. It never hurts. It's a day for feasting and enjoying a lot of different types of food, so I think we wanted to explore what are some interesting options, especially some things you might not have come to mind. In the beer world, for example, everyone always thinks like pumpkin ales, like spiced stuff for Thanksgiving. That was always a go-to thing. It's a layup. Yeah. We're going to try to do some things that aren't necessarily layups. I imagine libations at Chris's house for Thanksgiving are just off the hook. Off the hook. Yeah. I try to make it so. All right. Cool. Well, we should probably start with beer because we have these chilled down beers. So Roger, where do you start? Do you separate your beers into pairing with certain dishes, or do you just go hard at it all day here? I've done it a couple of different ways over the years. I've written some beer buzz pieces about this and blog articles, just trying to give people a little bit of an idea about what they can pair with certain dishes. So there are certain beers that I think lend themselves to specific dishes. But for the three that I brought today, I just sort of went the route of what are three options that I think will appeal to a large audience and will work with a lot of different dishes. So that was kind of the approach. I'm thirsty, so pour a beer already, please. All righty. Just because I love talking about bottle-conditioned beer. We couldn't even name the beer before he brought up bottle conditioning. Damn it, Roger. So in a nod to the wine drinkers here, I ended up bringing two beers that are extremely wine-like. So that was partially in an effort for all these people that just kind of decide they don't like beer. I'm going to present you with a beer that I bet, even if you don't think you traditionally like beer, or perhaps you're a little tired of IPAs and stouts, which kind of dominate the shelves these days. We're going old school with a Belgian-inspired beer here. This is from the beloved Unibrew Brewery in Quebec. The other reason I wanted to throw them some love is that they've always been really focused on pairing beer with food. They offer some nice recommendations on their website. They put together a really decent cookbook for cooking with their beer and some ideas about making beer cocktails and serving beer with different dishes. So when these beers were created, they were definitely made with enjoying them with food in mind. So they make a lot of amazing beers. If you've had one, you're probably familiar with their La Fin du Monde, which is their Belgian style triple. We've talked about that in the past. At length. I recommended that in the past for Thanksgiving. At length. So this is Don De Du, Gift from God. This, I think, is one of their beers that flies under the radar in the portfolio. They were never big on naming what style their beers were. They would just say Belgian ale. Sometimes strong ale they'd write. Now, this one's not as strong as some of the others you mentioned, like Maudite and Trois Pistoles are pretty strong, right? How strong is this? No, this is strong as well. I stand corrected. This is 8% alcohol, or maybe 9%. I think it's 9%. Yeah, 9%. 9%. They've decided recently to call this a Belgian style Imperial wheat ale. Still somewhat vague, but you shouldn't worry about what it is, just worry about that it's delicious. It's brewed with spices. again, they keep that close to the vest as far as what they're putting in here. There's some coriander in here, right? Yeah. No doubt. For sure. It's not just coriander. You can tell there's a little bit of something else. I wonder if they might use some like greens of paradise maybe or even like cardamom maybe. I don't know. I almost pick up a subtle pepper-like aroma too. The nice thing about the spice in here, I have to say is, is its subtlety. I mean, this is a pretty big body beer, but it drinks very easily. That coriander spice, you can nail the fact that it's coriander, no problem. But it's really well-integrated into the nose. I mean, there's lots of other fruity esters, and it has a soft apricot-y aroma to it. Yeah. I mean, like all Uniboo beers, it's really well-balanced. It's very drinkable. It's just a well-put-together beer. What do you think, Alicia? Yeah. I will second Chris' comments on just the subtlety of the spices, but yet kind of consistent across the palate. But also, I think the thing that stood out for me is just the texture, the weight, the roundness of the beer, I think speaks to their desire to make it so food-friendly. So it's quite pleasant. This has a nice honeyed quality to it that I think makes it a really good pairing for things like the sweet potatoes if you have those at the dinner table. It's going to work and well-contrasted with cranberry relish. It's highly carbonated. Roger's mouth is watering right now. Yeah. I think it will work with a ton of the dishes from turkey all the way through the sides. Because it has a touch of sweetness, it will even work with desserts. This would pair well with the pumpkin pie. So yeah, another winner from Unibrew, one that you might have glanced over, picked up one of them. I mean, the old school beer nerds know it. But yeah, give this a chance. It's a crazy good value. This is a 9% ABV beer. You can get in a four pack for 10 bucks. Delicious and versatile for everything on Thanksgiving. I think anyone who likes beer, even if they like different styles, could rally around this at the table. Yeah, it's very, very pleasant. I think it was a very wise choice as opposed to something like the Blanche de Chamblis or another lighter Whitbeer style just because this has the weight to pair with that food that those would be lackey, and they just be bowled over by all the flavors in the meal. But here, you've got some weight, some heft, but it's so balanced and easy drinking, you'd never know it was 9% at the table. You could even try throwing a little bit of this into like the gravy or the braising liquid for the turkey. Settle down. This was the first beer. Okay. What do you got next? All right. So this one's for Brophy here. We're trying to always get people interested in lagers. So for all those that are thirsty for a crispy boy. Always. We're going again kind of to Chris's point. I didn't want to just recommend like a Pilsner or a Hellas because I think they might get kind of bulled over by some of the dishes served at Thanksgiving. One of the go to's that some people might have for Thanksgiving is to have like an an Oktoberfest beer if you still have some of those hanging around in the fridge. So the next closest beer style, which you may not be familiar with the name, but chances are you've had one, is a Vienna style lager. They're popping up all over the place lately. Little Craft Breweries are starting to brew them. Art History out in Geneva, Dave Brew One, Goldfinger, Scorched Earth. It's really nice to see that this style is kind of showing up more. If you're a fan of Oktoberfest beers, there's a lot of similarities here. They typically feature that Vienna style malt, which is a little lighter, not quite as rich as a Munich malt, that would be one of the key components of an Oktoberfest. If you look at it in color, it's about the same color as an Oktoberfest. It's maybe a little bit lighter. It's not quite as rich, but similar flavors there. The thing I love about it is that there's actually some refreshingness to this. It should finish with a moderate level of bitterness. People that just enjoy things like more traditional lagers, like Pilsners, this is just sort of like a step with a little more flavor, a little more body. Yeah, slightly sweet toasted malt character to it. Nice dryish, slightly bitter finish. Now, do we even say what beer this was? This is dovetail's Vienna Lager. Roger, why do you think the Vienna style lager is seeing a resurgence? Well, food wise, it's like one of those Swiss Army food pairing things. This goes well with just about anything. It's got that caramelized character that will mimic and accentuate essentially the Mellard reaction that you're looking for in so much cooking. So when you read books like Amber Ales and then Amber Lagers, which are sometimes referred to like as red lagers, they often get recommended for everything under the sun. Like are you having barbecue? Are you having something spicy? Like everything under the sun, a nice amber lager or amber ale usually works pretty well with it. I think for as many people as love Pilsners or Helles, the lighter lagers, they still can have trouble sometimes differentiating them from what they think of as just big beer, like big import beer, big macro beer. But when they drink something like this, that's an all malt beer, no adjuncts, so no corn or rice. You're really just tasting the quality of the base ingredients. So the quality of the malt used in dovetails, this is all 100 percent Vienna malt, and then the hops. So the hops here are Styrian Golding hops, very old school, European hop. I think people love that it's both simple enough, but it's by no means boring. It's one of these beers that is satisfying, not just refreshing kind of deal. There's a little more here than just if you were to only use paler malts and the bitterness is there, but not like beat you over the head. I think it can appeal to just a ton of people, and if you're thirsty and you want to have more, you want to drink a beer and then maybe have another one, a beer like a Vienna Lager is something you can order another one of. It's not like so many of the beers now are really interesting. They can have really crazy flavors, but some of these big, really thick IPAs, you don't necessarily want two of them. You're absolutely right. You don't want something that's too heavy with your meal. In a lot of cases, lighter or as light as you can get it, contrast to all the weight of the food is nice, some refreshment. This beer certainly provides that. It's got that rich caramely flavor. What's impressing me the most about this is the nose here. Those, did you say Styrian Goldings? Yeah. Those hops are so florally aromatic in this beer. It's just gorgeous in the nose. On the palate, it's got that sweet caramely flavor. That's going to be absolutely perfect with poultry, particularly that maillard reaction that you get in that brown caramely skin of turkey or chicken. That's going to be incredible with that. If you're amping up any other caramely flavors in your meal, like you're doing Brussels sprouts and roasting them or something like that, where you're getting deeper, naturally sweet caramely flavors, this beer is going to be absolutely phenomenal. Chances are you've had a Vienna and you didn't realize it, so like Victoria, I know it was a huge deal when we finally got that. The way it was pitched was like, oh, Americans think Mexican beer is Corona, but. I love that we're just ignoring that Sam Adams' Boston Lager is a Vienna-style lager. You've probably had one and just didn't know it. How about this Mexican beer, Victoria, that's only been in the market for eight years? I've never heard of. All right, fair enough. I love what a clean bitterness this dovetail has on the finish. It really does a nice job of scrubbing a bit of the maltiness away on its way out. Would be a really fantastic food beer. Yeah, it's just super light on its feet. My non-turkey pairing that I had recently at home, French onion soup. That would be good with this. Have you ever put any of the beer into the French onion soup? Yes. So double duty. Here we go. Boom. Yeah, this is a good beard of cook with too. Yeah. What is French onion soup all about? Caramelized onions. All right, Roger, what's next? All right, the final option we have here is a belt. You only brought three things? Yeah. Oh, good thing I brought like seven again. Typical. I'm a huge fan of Belgian beers, and this one I think you get a kick out of, Brof, is now available in big, tall 16.9-ounce cans. Oh, that's awesome. We were asking for cans for years. This is Rodenbach Classic that we're passing around the table here, which is the less expensive option of Rodenbach, and the big difference is it has less of the footer-aged beer blended into it. So this is more young beer, less old beer than what's the higher-end Rodenbach called now, and it's a higher proportion of old beer. Yeah, the Grand Cru. Which is higher proportion of old beer versus fresh beer. If you're not sure where this is on the shelf, it's the very boring can design. It's so dull. Oh, it's not that bad. This is a rebranding. This is brand new. This is how they've judged it up. Yeah. Such a leap for such a traditional brewery who put their beers in 750 cork finish bottles. I mean, what a forward thinking thing to do for a brewery like this. Yeah, they're bringing a beer that, if you want to talk about time and effort, this beer, as Brof said, is a blend of two different young beer and older age beer. The older age component of this spends two years in oak fooders. These are giant fooders. I mean, the Flemish red ale tradition is not an inexpensive brewing tradition. Some of these fooders are so treasured. You can swim in those fooders. Yeah, and they're so treasured and impart this microflora that's trapped in the wood is what's producing all the flavors in this beer. It has this crazy mixture of sweetness and acidity and fruitiness, and it's all just from the magic of microbiology that happens in this unique little atmosphere of a big oak barrel. That's right, baby. Pidiocacus and Lactobacillus. I love that they point out on the can, refreshing. It just says, Rodenbach Classic, refreshing Belgian sour ale, oak aged. 5.2% and it really is refreshing. It's supremely refreshing, mostly because of the acidity and very venous in its flavor profile. It's a classic and I don't think we can put too fine a point on the role of those, the microflora. Some of these fooders are like 100 plus years old. Is there any headspace left in the barrel? They're filling it completely and then- Yeah. It's pretty full. Okay. They want it to be relatively full because there's acetylbacter in there. If you let there be too much airspace, that needs oxygen so it can end up being really vinegary. Okay. I really like this beer. And I have to say, I don't think I've really had anything like it before. I mean, when you think about sour beers, at least the ones that come to my mind, it's like one and done. If you can even have a whole one and they're so tart and they're so intense, the nuance in this beer is just extraordinary. This is the classic beer. I feel like 15 years ago, at the start of this second wave of craft brewing revolution, we were like, how do we get more people to drink beer? How do we get wine drinkers to drink beer? It was always, have them try Rotenbach. I love this. These Flemish ales are actually called the Burgundies of Belgium, is one of the ways it's referred to. One reason that this is coming off as so, in my opinion, sweet with just a hint of sour is that it's the classic. Like Pat said, it's basically three-quarters young beer with just a quarter of that more sour aged beer. Speaking of a beer that can go with almost everything on your plate in Thanksgiving, I think this is it. Oh yeah. Thank you for that. The idea behind this was that just like how you use cranberry relish at the table, it works with everything. The flavors here mimic cranberry relish in a lot of ways. There's that sweetness, there's the acidity, there's the fruitiness that's almost cranberry-like. That was why in particular I wanted the classic, besides that it's in this unbelievably good value package now, I wanted it because the classic is much more like a cranberry. What are we selling Kansas for? They're in four packs, I assume? $11.99. Wow. For four 16-ounce packs. Hell yeah. We used to sell a 750 ml cork and cage of this for like $8 or $9.99. I know. $11.99 for four half pints. For four pints, excuse me. Wow. It's never been susceptible to skunking or anything like a lot of beers because the hop element is very subtler. I've never tasted a better tasting example of this than out of this can. Really, it's hard to find a better value on our shelves. This is an unbelievable beer for you get four 16.9 ounce cans for $12. For the production expense that goes into making a beer like this, pretty remarkable. All right, let's go to wine next, I guess. Are we starting with this Lambrusco? Last time we tasted a Lambrusco, I feel like we really made fun of it a lot. Did we do that, or am I confusing that with smooch? No, it is a much maligned beverage. There's no doubt about it. I mean, back in the 60s, 70s, 80s, you had the dominance of sweet, fruity, rather insipid Lambrusco. The thing with Lambrusco is that it's not a protected name like, say, Prosecco, that now is a region in Northeast Italy, and you can only call it Prosecco if it comes from there. Lambrusco, you can make these inexpensive, high-volume, just sweetened, really uninspiring examples. Boy, you really nailed it. That's this wine in the nutshell. I remember what you're talking about. We had one of these recently, and this one I'm enjoying quite a bit more than the, this is drier than the last one we had. Yeah, and there are some dry examples on our shelves, and some producers that are making great dry Lambrusco. So don't write off the whole category, go into a store and ask a wine consultant to help you out and select the dry examples. We're forgetting to say what the hell this wine is again. What is this? La Luna Lambrusco from the producer is Cara di Casatico. Cara di Casatico. There are a bunch of different Lambrusco varietals and they give you different results. Some are very light, some are very deep purple. It's a very weird wine in that it's bubbly, it's frizzante, and it's a red wine in a lot of cases, and it has tannic structure. I was going to say, it's got serious tannin. Yeah. It's also relatively exuberant in its fruit. So you can get some really grippy things. And people treat this quite seriously in Emilia-Romagna where it's coming from. There are a bunch of different areas around Bologna where this is made. And like I said, they use different versions of it. Like there's Grasparossa, which is particularly hearty and rich. And then this one's made out of something called Lambrusco Maestri. This is a roller coaster of a wine. This thing is all over the place. I mean, so much red fruit. Now, traditionally, you'd pair this with like fatty foods like salami, prosciutto de parma, Bolognese sauce. But we want to pair this with Thanksgiving. Yeah, and the Thanksgiving meal has got funnier fatty richness as the smaller everything in gravy. That's true. Exactly. So, you've got a rich fatty meal. And what you have here is the pretty decent acidity, cleansing bubbles, and some tannic structure. And all of that is designed to cut right through rich foods. I think it does it remarkably well. And it's kind of a weird choice, but I think you would notice the kind of red fruit character, cranberry, you know, maybe a little darker fruit like blackberry. Yeah, a couple of things. I mean, one, most lamb bruscos are made in the tank method. So, the second fermentation is happening in tank, not in bottle like you often see in champagne and other traditional method regions, though there are some. And so, it adds to that kind of fruity brightness that you get in the wine. But it's unique, as Chris said, in that it has, it has tannins, it has acid, it has body and a lot of fruit. So really from appetizers all the way through your meal, this is kind of a winner across the plate. So highly recommend it. And also, I mean, it's festive. The color is obviously this really deep ruby and something a little bit different, kind of in the same theme that Roger mentioned, rather than bringing the same sparkling wine that you always do, switching it up with little lamb brusco. So you can get a sweeter style if you'd like, but some even drier styles than this one are out there. This is pretty good. What are we selling this for? This is $19.99. Yeah, I like this. I think again, it fits that bill of just like you enjoy cranberry relish with everything on the plate, this I think works the same way. I think it'll pair really well across the board. Exactly the idea. And I don't think your goal with Thanksgiving wine pairing is to necessarily pick the most complex wine in the world. I think there's something to be said for fruity kind of fun, festive wines because the meal is so complicated. There's so many flavors going on. What you really want is a counterpoint refreshment, something that will cut through the weight, but complement it all at the same time. And I think the Lambrusco, especially the dry style, does that. All right, cool. Nice work. What's the next wine here? Well, we went a little bit out of the box with the Lambrusco. I had to show a Riesling for wine number two. Yeah, kind of the classic Thanksgiving thing. We have to give a shout out, yes. And keep in mind that there are a lot of places in the world you can go for Riesling, and maybe Germany and Austria are immediate contenders. But especially on an American holiday, why not look to a domestic region? And again, perhaps one that not all of your guests are as familiar with. So I selected Dr. Constantine Franks, dry Riesling from the Finger Lakes in upstate New York. And it's a Homer pick. Yeah. Yeah. Local shout out. Grew up outside Buffalo. Anyway, this is one of the coldest AVA's in the United States, situated around 11 finger shaped lakes. And glacial lakes, very deep, cold lakes. The depth of the lakes, oftentimes they don't freeze, especially Seneca Lake, which many of the vineyards are located around. And that helps the Vitis Vinifera survive over the winter. And Dr. Konstantin Frank, born in ukraine, that's where he got his PhD, came over with no money. And he was the first to overwinter Vitis Vinifera in this region. It was kind of the OG and set up his first winery, Vinifera Wine Cellars. And this was back in the 50s. Wow. I always just assumed it was a more modern mind making region. Yeah. Absolutely a Finger Lakes legend. Yeah. He was the first and he did this by grafting on a different kind of cold hardy rootstocks. He would then share that and it's widely done today all over the world. But this is their dry Riesling. So we have a pretty robust Finger Lakes selection. again, you can get Rieslings of all sweetness levels, but they're going to finish fermentation with this one. And I think it is in a nice kind of almost German style in that you do get the minerality, you do get the florality of the Riesling grape variety, but alongside all of the really nice kind of citrus and stone fruits that I think it's a white wine Yeah, stone fruit for sure. This is a really elegant and refreshing wine. The nose here is pretty incredible. It's very nuanced. There's nothing that just pops out immediately, but it has such a nice bouquet to it. It's pretty amazing. It's delicious. Do you get that kind of wet stone, river rock flinty quality to it a little bit? That slate minerality, I love with Riesling. again, classic for your turkey, but really anything else too. I think it's just fine. As was pointed out, it does still allow the food to be the star of the show with your Thanksgiving meal. How much is this bottle? Yeah. Another great thing with this wine, it's $15.99. Holy cow. We all definitely are at our Thanksgiving table, and you pass the wine around, and then there's like Uncle Frank or something down at the end of the table, and you're just cringing as he pours this huge glass of whatever you're serving. So this way, you don't have to- So Constantine Frank is a good Uncle Frank. Got it. You don't have to get too mad that they're wasting your expensive wine. All right, excellent. Good job, Finger Lakes and Dr. Constantine Frank. What else we want to talk about with wine? I mean, the classic, I feel like the classic red that everyone's told to recommend for Turkey is a Pinot Noir. Did you bring a Pinot Noir? No, we didn't. We are avoiding some of the real obvious choices like Pinot or beaujolais. But we did bring a red wine that I thought would be interesting for its similarity in certain ways to those wines. We're going to try Bonnie Doon Vineyard's Le Cigar Volant 2020. This is one of the strangest wines I've ever tasted. Really? Yeah. Well, honestly, I've never tasted this before, which is why I picked it because sometimes you just got to take a flyer. Now, what he's done here is he's pumped up the quantity of Sinso and toned down some of the darker fruit elements. What I'm expecting here is medium bodied, aromatic, maybe a little herbaceous and spicy, but with flavors of strawberry, raspberry, cherry. Pretty easy going wine. Is it not that? I haven't tasted it yet. You described it quite well actually. No, what I think Pat's getting at actually, so this is a rhone blend over in California, and what is sticking out alongside all this fruit that perhaps Pat isn't used to or whatever. I think it's smoky and sulfury. It's not sulfur, it's just the savoriness that is coming from these rhone bridles, this smoked meat quality that actually Chris is a little more pronounced than the blend would indicate. It's 56 percent granache. And Chris, we have the 19, by the way. And, you know, your Syrah is only at 13 percent, but there's still this smoked meat, peppery, savory quality that is really standing up quite boldly next to the red fruit. Do you think that's it? That's interesting because I do have the 2020. Bonnie Doon was always making very, very savory wines, herbaceous, spicy, meaty, very much in kind of like more old school than most Chateauneuf-du-Pope producers are even today, you know, modeled after kind of a very, kind of almost a lost style in And fruit driven now. To me, there's a very pronounced like all spice character to it. Couldn't help yourself. Pimento, if you will. This wine, especially the 19, but it's your old world wine lover at the table. It's a little rustic. It's kind of just a little dirty in a good way, but yet it's very light on its feet. Tons of red fruit, high acid, very refreshing style. So if you're a Pinot fan, if you're a beaujolais fan and just a Rhone fan in general, you will enjoy this wine. I think this would be great with the stuffing, like the marriage of the herbaceousness that you were talking about and the spice. I think that would go perfect. Especially if you put bacon in your stuffing. I was going to ask, do you put any meat in your stuffing? Yes. A mixture of pork, sausage, and beef. This would be perfect for that. By the way, that Bonnie dune, Chris, thanks for bringing that. Another just iconic producer. This is in the Central Coast, this particular wine, but go ahead and look for some excellent Rome blends coming out of that part of the country. So, I don't have a child yet, but if I had one and I was about to tell them that they were going to go to Disney World or something like that, that's basically how excited I was to tell Roger today that we're going to show him Madeira. I didn't get as much of a reaction as I was hoping for, but I know he's pretty pumped about this. Sorry, I just walked in after a really long commute that was kind of grinding, but I'm very excited. I think I have this exact bottle of Madeira open at my house currently. Well, you are a good man. Is it a rare wine company? Yeah. These are the goodies. No offense to the producers of Madeira because they are all great and various price points are out there. But this is the holidays. If you're going to show off Madeira, especially people who don't know it, and you want to just totally wow them, the rare wine company, their historic series is perfect. Not to mention the historical tie-in given Thanksgiving. Perfect tie-in. It's Thanksgiving. They have four different or five, I think five actually because they do a rainwater as well. They have different expressions that they name after towns where Madeira was particularly popular. This is from the island of Madeira, about 370 miles or so off the coast of Morocco. It's a Portuguese island, but back in the 17th and 18th centuries, the British merchants came in and started exporting these wines to the colonies in North America and the West Indies. It was consumed at a lot of really big moments for our country. Oh, yeah. We're talking, toasting some special occasion or momentous event, very popularly the signing of the Declaration of Independence. Madeira was the wine. We have covered this before. Let's talk about the wine. Okay. This is a fortified wine, but as was mentioned earlier, we have different grape varieties here, and this Malmsey style is the sweetest one. But what's unique about this, one, you should notice that the acid really sticks around. It's much higher in acidity than you might think of with some other fortifieds, and with fortification when we're adding in alcohol, we're thinking about port, think about sherry, and so forth. But with this one, they're storing this wine in these really large barrels, these large pipes, and in a warm environment, in the lofts, and in that, we get this oxidative style that is really indestructible. And so you hopefully are smelling this nutty, toffied nougat. But alongside, there's still some citrus-peeled, dried citrus undertones to the wine that keep it really fresh, and it's something you can keep for years. Once opened. Yeah. You can open this up and keep it for years. That, I think, is the hugest selling point on this, is that, yes, they're 50 some dollars, but think of it in the realm of spirits. I mean, lots of people wouldn't bat an eyelash spending $50 on a bottle of whiskey these days. This can sit in your spirit's cabinet once it's open. Agreed. This wine is incredible. I think your point about acidity, Alicia, is very important. The best Madeiras have beautiful acidity. Yeah. The reason I picked the Mom's Eat is because, again, we're thinking about your Thanksgiving table, and this is what you may serve after dinner. So people do want something a little bit sweeter. But also, if people haven't had Madeira and are approaching it like they would say a tawny port, I think you're going to win them over with the Mom's Eat style more so than going right to kind of Sir Ciel. To Chris's point, some of the inexpensive ones, they're throwing those in huge tanks, putting a heating jacket, if you will, on that, heating up that wine to some pretty high temperatures for at least 90 days. So just two different stories in terms of the length and the beauty of the maturation process when you compare this to some of the less expensive ones from Tinta Negra. And Malmsey is the sweetest of the four, but again, if you're getting the true grape varietal versus the ones that use the Tinta Negra, this isn't going to be even close to as sweet as some of the less expensive ones. So don't let it scare you away that this is the sweetest of the Madeiras. It still has that great balance of sweetness and acidity. So yes, it's a sweeter wine, but it's not cloyingly sweet. Totally agree with that. It's full of caramel and walnut shell and all kinds of exciting things offset by citrusy acidity. And I think it would be fantastic with a slice of pumpkin pie, personally. I also think pecan pie would be so good. Yes, agreed. I always do the cooking for Thanksgiving. I'm one of many people that does, but I put in a good amount of work in the kitchen. And if you've ever played that role and you make your gravy, it can be one of those tedious processes where you taste the gravy and you're like, there's just not enough depth of flavor there. Like it still tastes kind of boring, even if it's been sitting on the stove for hours. Add a little bit of Madeira to your gravy. It is a, you will blow your mind the amount of flavor you're going to infuse. No s***. That is an amazing idea. I'm going to try that. Marsala wine from Sicily is produced in a very similar way. And, you know, people love chicken Marsala or Madeira chicken. You could make a beautiful Madeira and mushroom or black truffle sauce to go with beef. Yeah, like chicken Madeira is one of those classic sauces. And sadly, a lot of people were buying this insipid Madeira fake Madeira wine garbage that's like basically seasoned cooking wine. Or they're buying like rainwater Madeira that's just not- Don't do that, people. Only cook with wine that you would drink. So, you know, with Madeira, when you're using it for a recipe, buy a good Madeira because you're going to want to drink it with- And you don't have to, you know, this one's on the shelf for $52.99. There are other great examples, you know, well down into the high 20s, low 30s that you can get. So just go visit the Madeira section in our stores, please. This is another one, speaking of our Flemish red ale that people need to drink more of. And, you know, Roger's going to come to your house and hunt you down if you don't serve this with your pie. So I just bought a bottle of Blandy's 10-year Malmsey, and I think I might have to do a little side by side and see which of these two stacks up the best. So that was Roger just claiming the bottle to take home. No, no, I already claimed this bottle. You said you had it at home. No, I think it's a different one. I think it's a different one. It's the bottle. The great point though with just to button it up here, a wine beloved by colonial people, it absolutely should be served at Thanksgiving. So great choice. Yeah, let's not forget the reason for this holiday. I will preface this by saying, I do think pairing spirits and food feels a bit forced. I know I have some very, very good friends who swear by pairing whiskey and food. I always think it's a bit forced. And I rarely want to drink that much, you know, hard alcohol while I'm eating dinner. For that reason, I think cocktails are probably a better option. But, you know, this is something that's interesting, and it can still be done very well. So, I'm kind of looking at this on a meta level, and I took categories that I think would pair well with certain parts of a Thanksgiving, of a traditional Thanksgiving meal, and then I just kind of picked some, you know, solid picks from that I twisted Pat's arm here and wanted him to do this, so thanks for acquiescing. I just don't like when people act, it's almost like stigmatized that you can't drink a glass of whiskey while you're eating dinner. And I think that that is just a shame, because sometimes it really works. It took going to a Scotch dinner for me to really start to rethink that. Well, there's some great things out there. So we're telling you that it's okay. It's okay to drink your whiskey at the dinner table. And it's okay to drink a beer, wine and spirit throughout the entire day. That's what Thanksgiving is all about. You don't need to just pick one. Well, okay. I mean, I never have less than three or four glasses in front of me at Thanksgiving. Well done, Chris. All right, so if we're starting, I think meta level, if you're looking at turkey, I think the most reasonable whiskey to pair with it is bourbon. certainly something that's a little sweeter, higher in corn content, nice vanilla, caramel, butterscotch, coconut, you know, that kind of thing going on. You brought us wild turkey? No, I said coconut. I remember taking shots of wild turkey when I was in college. Nice. Turkey on Turkey Day. I mean, that's what I was supposed to. Roger specifically asked me to bring wild turkey, and I said I would. I mean, it's kind of a layup. But we have a really good option that's fairly inexpensive in our house label, Clark and Sheffield. So there's a Clark and Sheffield small batch, and then there's a Clark and Sheffield single barrel. I brought the single barrel today. This was distilled at the Barton Distillery, the old Barton Distillery in Barsound, Kentucky, very high corn recipe bourbon, a little bit of rye in there. Old Barton, a hidden gem, owned by the Sazerac Company now. So all of you Buffalo Trace fanatics, I almost regret saying this, but you should be paying more attention to the Barton Distillery. Yeah. Well, this is just a nice rich bourbon. This is something that you can drink with turkey, sweet potato, certainly sweet potato casserole type of thing. It should go in your sweet potato casserole. There you go. That's how you get Uncle Frank to quiet down. Our cranberry sauce at our house is actually a bourbon cranberry compote, and it's very good. It's interesting. I'll send you the recipe, Roger. I also think, not only just the entrees, but think about this serving it in cocktails or neat, but with your appetizers as well. I think there's a lot of play, and there's a lot of sweetness in various puff pastry things that we often have at this time. Yeah, that's true. Chris, what do you think? Strangely, I was thinking dessert for the exact same reason. Yeah, I mean, it was pecan pie. Pecan pie, bourbon, classic pairing, anywhere in the South. But I do have a dessert, a slightly... Now, Chris, you're missing out on a couple of things because I kind of, you know, of course, just winged it at the last second here and have a couple things that happened across my desk this morning that we're going to taste as well. So, what if you don't like that sad trombone you played? Yeah, we do got to lay down those sad trombone tracks, Barret. Well, before we move on, I don't think we've even discussed this whiskey, which is quite nice. Honestly, it's been a while since I've tasted the Clark and Sheffield bourbon, and I've never had this single barrel. To me, it seems drier than the basic Clark and Sheffield. Is that accurate? I think so. I think it tastes notably a little bit older. I think there's more of an oak influence, less of that juicy fruit young bourbon character to it. Right. On the nose, it's not particularly fruity. I get more oak and mineral, almost limestone-y type mineral. And then on the palate, it just bursts with caramel and vanilla. Yeah. And that's why I wanted to pick it for the reasons stated. I think it's a fantastic all-around bottle. Our regular everyday price on this is like 35 bucks. Totally reasonable. And it's around all the time. That's one of the highlights here. I think a takeaway, it's been a little sad to see what's happened with bourbon, where people have gotten really snobby about what was essentially a very American egalitarian kind of drink. Like you could be rich and you could be working class and you'd enjoy essentially the same type of bourbon. But don't let yourself fall prey to that. If you want a good bourbon, it has to cost fill in the blank. That I find very annoying. And this is a superb bourbon and it's super affordable. Yeah. Yeah. Great stuff. Yeah. I think it's it's remarkably solid. And contrary to what I said before, when I let it spread out on my palate, I get more fruity aromas and flavors out of it too. So very nice. See something to come back to with every sip there. All right. So Pat brought his typical bag of tricks, which means he has like nine things. So let's keep moving. But also Pat, what if we're not going to have turkey? You don't like turkey? Well, screw you. You know, that's it. I know we have some people who don't like turkey. So what else do you make at Thanksgiving? A ham, I guess, right? Some people have ham. So that kind of cured smoked pork pairing, the classic is a slightly smoky scotch whiskey. And I say slightly because if you have one of those whiskeys, that's as smoky as they can make it type of thing or really exceptionally briny or iodiney with the smoke. At some point, you're not going to taste much of anything else besides that whiskey. So the one I chose actually is Brook Laddie's Port Charlotte 10-year-old. So anything, Brook Laddie is one of the two distilleries on Islay known for more of their unpeated malt. When they restarted, they had really the unpeated stuff under the Brook Laddie label, and then their heavily peated stuff under the Port Charlotte label. Port Charlotte is the name of a now-defunct distillery that was nearby actually. So this is 10-year-old Islay whiskey. I like it that it's bottled at 100 proof and it's non-chill filtered. I think that's really rare, increasingly rare in Scotch these days, to see a normal bottling at 100 proof. And this is the same kind of peated malt that the rest of the distillers on the island are getting, but they're not using quite as much as somebody like a LaFroyger, you know, an Ardbeg. What cask are they using? This is primarily ex-Burban casks, but I'm sure there's some sherry blended in there. They don't specifically say, but they're almost always a bit of a melange. Just so our viewers know, like it's interesting to hear your description of it, because the full name of this is Port Charlotte Heavily Peeted, and I don't disagree with you. This is like really pleasant and like you know the peets there, but it's not over the top like some of them are. Yeah, it's heavily peeted for that distillery, but if you go down the road 15 minutes and you're at LaFroyger, Ardbeg, it's not particularly heavily peeted for them. I think it's interesting that Brook Laddie makes some really beautiful malt whiskeys that are unpeeted on Islay and they use local grain too. Is that not true? Yeah, they use it when they can. I really like that they non-chill filter and don't color their whiskeys either. Like there's no coloring added to any of these Brook Laddie bottlings. Yeah, that's really important. Appropriately pale Scotch whisky indicating no caramel or anything. I'm not a huge fan of heavily peated Scotch, but this nose is incredibly appealing to me. Now, I will admit to me, there's a hint of phenolic bandaid in there, but mostly it's beautifully smoky, kind of almost bacony. Yeah, there's a clean meat smoke to it. And I think there's still some fruit there and some, you know, that darker dried fruit malt barley character. It's really well layered. You can still smell the fruit through the smoke. So I'm going to totally give them props for the balance on this in the nose. And I have yet to even taste it, but I'm kind of falling in love with it just as it is. It's gorgeous whisky. I'm just imagining this with almost any other meat. I mean, if you're smoking or grilling anything, this would be awesome. Yeah. So not even just for ham, but I mean, truly any other meat. Chris, you nailed it with the aroma on this. That's the real thing about it. The whisky is great, but the aroma is just unbelievable on this scotch. It's great. It's fantastic. I mean, if you believe in aroma therapy, I would argue that this should be just something you have on your desk. I mean, you could use this as cologne. We've got turkey covered, we've got ham covered. I figured a versatile whiskey for many side dishes, whether it was something like cranberry sauce or stuffing, certainly stuffing, like Roger Rye would make it with a little bit of sausage that's got some spice in it, is a rye whiskey. And I didn't choose just any rye whiskey, I specifically chose one that is very low rye, where that's right for the 38th time in Barrel to Bottle history, we are now talking about Rittenhouse rye, bottled in Bond, four-year-old hundred proof rye, made with a scant 51 or 52 percent rye. So because it has all that corn to balance it out, it still has a nice rich fatness to it and sweetness to it, that is going to really play off that spice nicely, when you're having it with something like And as we mentioned, the Clark and Sheffield is coming out of the Barton Distillery. This is Heaven Hill product, right? Yes, this is Heaven Hill's product now. For years, it was actually made at Old Forester. And then recently, though, the production has come back to Heaven Hill itself. Sweet potatoes with the brown sugar and this are perfect. Yes. This has been a go-to rye for me for a long, long time. Yeah, it's an all-time classic. It's like 28 bucks. I mean, it's hard to beat. If you're just looking for a break, I mean, everybody's been talking about bourbon lately, and it's what a lot of people are getting into. If you're curious about rye, this is an easy bridge between the two styles because of that mash bill you're talking about. It's a bourbon lover's rye for sure. Yeah. But again, I do want to keep the focus on the meal at hand, I suppose, and I'm glad you guys agree with me. I think this is a good for as versatile as the sides can be and how there's a lot of different flavors going on, and they all pair with each other. I think this rye whiskey serves the same purpose. I'll put it that way. Yeah, absolutely. I think it's the mash bill that's doing all of those favors for you. It's the fact that there's a high corn proportion in there that's keeping it sweet up front, which I think you really need, but you can definitely sense that rye spice on the finish. Yeah, it's a bourbon drinker's rye, but that's, I think, what you're after in this situation, because you need that corny sweetness. Yeah, and that's why it makes it so useful, I think, for pairing with food. You know, otherwise, if it was a lot of times, not always, but a lot of times, very high rye content mash bills tend to get very lean and punchy, and I just don't see that being as useful with a food pairing. Are we gonna talk about under burger or whatever? No, we're gonna talk about, well, yeah, we're gonna talk about under burger, but first we have to, but that's our second Amaro for the day. Greg had to dabble in some under burger earlier to get rid of the kale taste that he had. All right, so you've had your dinner, you've politely asked your guests to leave. Now, you really gotta get your stomach in order before you can lie down and go to sleep. So what do you do? You gotta reach for an Amaro. Of course. So Pat. Oh yeah. Notice that Pat kicked the guests out before he let them drink the Amaro. He's like, you jokers, get out of here. So, well, I went with a very easy drinking Amaro in the light to medium style of Amari. Really so Roger didn't accuse me of pouring him something that smelled like a four-service bathroom. I was going to say, if there's an Amaro that Roger and Alicia will like, it's got to be this one. It's so gentle. It's so beautiful. It's all sweet orange up front, bitter orange on the finish, caramelized. It smells like one of my favorite hand soaps. It's a great combination of citrus and mint, and a bit of that cocoa character. This is a classic. It's Amaro Montenegro, widely available. I just drink it, of course, just over a glass, over a large rock, over a large ice cube with a citrus twist. Well, thanks Alicia. I tried this last night and loved it. And now that you said it smells like soap, that's immediately all I smell is that it smells like fancy soap. Oh no. Yeah, Aesop hand soap. This is your next recipe. You didn't know that Roger's other great passion in life was artisanal soaps? Really? Do you like the Aesop Bergamot Rind? That is my favorite. You two can start a spin-off podcast on soap, okay? But this is not overly bitter for an Amaro. It's not. It's a bit piney on the finish, but it's not over-the-top bitter. I love the Samaro. It's beautiful. The only Amaro's I've ever purchased are this and Averna. Like I was going to say, I've recommended this a ton over the years. It's a beautiful bottle, but yeah, it's definitely very approachable for an Amaro. It's great, and it's a nice digestive. You ate a little too much. This will settle your stomach down a little bit. It's awesome. How long can one keep an Amaro? Quite a while. This is a standard Amaro in that it's got a base of a distilled spirit, essentially a neutral grape brandy base. So it will keep. It's so beautiful, and it's sweet orange fruit up front, and then that not overwhelming bitterness on the finish is just lovely. I would argue the only more gentle training wheels Amaro you can get is probably Cardamaro, which is a Vien Amaro. So you would have to refrigerate it after opening, and probably consume it in a month or so. Is there a way to tell on an Amaro if it's been from wine or from distilled wine? They're generally labeled as Vien Amaro if they're from wine. This I would say too, a lot of cocktail bars, more modern establishments, are always trying to work in Amaro's into cocktails. When it works, it's amazing, but a lot of them are too burly and just overtake the cocktail, and it just seems like they stick out, they're not integrated, they just dominate the cocktail. This is one that I think you can actually mix. There's an argument to be made that you should try mixing this with whiskeys. I agree. This is a great Amaro for a black Manhattan, because it's not going to totally dominate. It's so many Amari are just so singular and powerful in some botanical or the other or in bitterness, and this is not any of that. Especially with Chris has pointed out the citrus several times now, that citrus plays so well in a drink like Manhattan or an old-fashioned, it really works. Or a Negroni. You could totally swap out Campari for this in a Negroni. It also has this incredibly smooth, silky texture. I just want to have it on soon. That's as all Amari should be enjoyed. Well, this is great. The other thing that of course is ingested in my home after Thanksgiving dinner is another classic style of Amaro, the Croucher Liquor. My favorite, the Onderberg. We don't have to taste that, right? No, you don't have to taste it today. I'm actually down to my last 20 Onderbergs in my house, so it's time for my yearly refill. My wife fills a giant Christmas stocking full of Onderberg bottles for me every year and then it gets slowly consumed throughout the year. It is an amazing product. It really is. The other day, it works. I tell people this and it sounds fantastical and ridiculous, like many things I say, but this is actually true. You can have Thanksgiving dinner and you feel so incredibly full, like that uncomfortable, like you don't even want to walk anywhere full, have an Onderberg and 10 minutes later, you'll be like, wow, I could eat more right now. That's why I love Onderberg because I love eating more right now. It's the reset button. It's unreal how well it works. We can't talk about Thanksgiving without talking about Onderberg. Sorry, Alicia. I'm sorry. You knew it was coming. I know. All right. Well, that's what I got for- Do your guests get those at least before they go or do they- Pat gives those as a wedding. Yeah. I would like to see you at the door handing them out like Santa, like, all right, thanks for coming. Here's your Onderberg. I'm going to have a bowl of Onderbergs and a bowl of Halloween candy next year on Halloween. The best because, you know, Pat lives out in the middle of nowhere. By the time you actually get to your car from his house, you probably can consume the entire Onderberg. So you're kind of good to go. That's why I hand out three packs. All right, people, drink well on Thanksgiving. Yeah, have fun with it and don't make it scientific. Like we've had Lambrusco here, we've just had some random spirits that are probably going to do well. We didn't have the classic, this beer has to be paired with this. We had three different beers here that paired with anything you're going to have that day. And we didn't have Pinot Noir with our turkey. We had whatever the hell that thing was. What was that? Roan Blend from the Central Coast. A Roan Blend from the Central Coast. Cool. They're they're cool. Sure. But the point is, you know, enjoy yourself. You're having a lot of food. Chances are you're putting up with people that you'd rather not be putting up with. So the least you can do is pour yourself something nice to drink. All right. Happy Thanksgiving, you guys. Until next week, I'm Pat. I'm Roger. I'm Alicia. And I'm Chris. Keep tasting. Oh, did I interrupt your Amaro segment? Hey, where are you going with that? That's not for you. What's that? That. No, that. You gotta participate. Oh, that's a special treat I brought for the podcast participants. Sorry, buddy.

Around this time of year, I'm really big on an old classic, early American favorite, a drink called the Stone Fence, which is a mixture of apple cider and some sort of- Rye whiskey or rum or apple brandy. Yeah, so originally it was rum, just because early Americans had access to a ton of rum. Then once we started making a lot of whiskey, it morphed into rye. And then in recent years, just I think because of the popularity of bourbon, it's usually referenced that you should make it with bourbon. I would argue that of those three options, I think rye is the best because it's not as sweet as a rum or a bourbon. I've made it with all three. Of course. Yeah, I've made it with literally all three at the same time too. Yeah, I also think that apple and rye spice combo really works together, honestly. Bourbon does bring often too much just round sweetness. A rye will bring you that spicy cut, and it just works so well with apple flavors. Yeah. I think that would be, if you're looking for a signature cocktail, it doesn't get easier for Thanksgiving to make a bunch of stone fences. You can put a big cinnamon stick in them if you want. It's a great option for before dinner or during the dinner. Yeah. Good during dinner cocktail. Those flavors work with everything else you're working with on Thanksgiving. So I've got a couple. Well, actually here, we'll do this next. Chris, you don't have this one because I just grabbed it this morning. We happen to be writing it up for the Whiskey Hotline this week. We'll get a real trombone in there soon enough, don't you worry. This just came in, so we just got more Jepson's Bourbon Handpicks. Jepson maker of Malort, of course. So this is the CH Distillery down on the south side. This is one of our latest handpicks from the Whiskey Hotline. This is a Jepson Bourbon. It is sourced from MGP in Indiana and finished in a Sherry barrel. So I thought this would be interesting for the same purpose of kind of looking at it with a couple of those, sometimes richer and sweeter, sometimes herbal side dishes. And this could be a pretty cool thing to enjoy with all that, just from that dark fruit and dried, you know, nuttiness that the Sherry cast can bring. I picked up one of these Sherry finished ones last time you did picks. This is probably even better than the last one I had. This is awesome. This one's awesome. This is Alicia. I think it's cask S8. So this is the only Sherry cast pick that's out there right now. Last time around, I think we did some cognacs. This is awesome and it's 40 bucks. Do you think that the fruit quality in that slightly sweet, yeah, the sweet fruit quality that the Sherry cast kind of brings out, you think that allows it to pair with the umami and like the mushroom green bean side dish? I think so, but I think if anything, there's a drying finish on this. Like there's a grippy dryness to it. Now it's cast strength too. But I get a lot of dried fruit out of this. And I think that kind of dried fruit, that raisiny plummy character, I think is really interesting with something like a sweet potato. Yeah. I'm not sure about the green bean casserole, though. I'm not sure how this would play with the green bean casserole. I'm trying to think which one would go best with that. I think more the rye on that. The rye? Personally. But this is awesome, though. This is a hell of a lot of whiskey for $40. What's the proof on this, Alicia? You got the bottle over by you. $116.2. For $40. For $40. Yeah. And again, it's like a six-year-old bourbon and finished in sherry for half a year or something. I, for one, hate this selection, mostly because I don't have it. Yeah, I'm sorry. We'll get it to you at some point here, Chris. It's the worst. It came across my desk this morning. I was like, wow, we should be talking about this with Thanksgiving Dinner. Well, I'm glad that you, I'm glad we talked about it because I think a lot of people might be confused when they see the Jepson's bourbon. They just think of Malort and they're just like, what is this? Is it going to be, is it finished in Malort barrels? Or just to be clear, this is just hand-selected bourbon from NGP. So they source bourbons from Indiana and Tennessee, and then they blend them together for the standard Jepson's bourbon. When we do single barrels, they are labeled on the back what state, what the source is. It'll say Indiana or Tennessee. And this is an Indiana finished in a sherry cask. On the other hand, if you have relatives who are likely to engage in political argumentation at Thanksgiving, just serve Malort through the whole meal. You'll have the angriest table of people you'll ever seen. There's a Jepson's for people you like, and a Jepson's for people you don't. There you go. All right. Now, this one came out of the personal stash at the house. I just opened this up last Saturday with some friends, and I forgot how amazing it was. And my first thought was like, holy cow, this would be really awesome with turkey. And it's a whiskey, and you know how I feel about pairing whiskey with food. So I'm surprised we haven't brought this up yet, Roger. But almost every year on Thanksgiving, we talk about the classic pairing of honey beers with turkey or sometimes meads. But in my something I've always held is that one of the best beers you can buy to pair with turkey at Thanksgiving dinner is DuPont Brewery's Beer de Miel, essentially a honey saison. And so what I have here, this was a handpick we did last year, I think. And it's long gone, sorry, it's kind of a tease. But it's a rye whiskey that was finished. They're showing something they can't buy. Yes, because we're talking about how good it is with Thanksgiving. Fine, you don't have to taste it. Roger and I will drink it. It's a single barrel starlight distillery, so that's the Huber Winery down in Southern Indiana. It's a rye whiskey finished in a honey barrel. So a bourbon barrel that then aged actual honey. All right, well, let's do them in favor. Is there anything similar that they can buy now? Honey barrel finished whiskeys are really hard to come by. Okay, so we'll all just enjoy this as you all listen in. We can cut it or Jim wants to cut it. Take a moment to respond to your text messages. Also not available for years. Cezanne DuPont. Oh, it's not available? No. Really? Sadly. Wait till you taste how good this is. Wow. Yeah, that's pretty awesome. Roger's in his happy place right now. Boy, Whiskey Barrel-aged Honey, I don't think I've ever come across that. You see the maple syrup, but... Get with the program, honey makers. I could not share this with you guys for this purpose. So good. Chris, I'm so sorry. No, we're going to send a little bottle over there at some point. It's really nice packaging as well, I must say. That's my man. I really want to Greg to try it. Too bad he insisted on trying to weasel out of a podcast. I mean, it's another good reminder. We've been really beaten the drum for your favorite cocktail. Honey and bourbon works. Or in a whiskey in general. This is cast rank too, and it's so good. Speaking of which, Pat, remember the penicillin cocktail? Oh, yeah. That freaking Port Charlotte. Oh, it'd make a mean penicillin. Maybe combined with this honey whiskey. That would be interesting. I will report back. I have both those bottles at home. And some ginger syrup already. Hell, yeah.